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Old 08/09/11, 06:37   #1 (permalink)
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Default This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

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Goodmorning,

Just saw this on Japan Camera Hunter:

Fujifilm announcement – The future of film | Japan Camera Hunter

It is not a good start of my day.


Cheers,

BJ
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Old 08/09/11, 07:24   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

Not a good sign at all. I don't use any of those films, but it doesn't say good things about film sales.
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Old 08/09/11, 07:48   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

Sad but inevitable, as film gradually becomes a niche, high-art cottage industry.
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Old 08/09/11, 08:19   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

Could have been worse - pretty marginal stuff:

Astia in pro formats (120,220,sheets) - a Provia "flavor" aimed at glamour/fashion pros for skin tones. How many of those pros still shoot film, and how many film enthusiasts shoot fashion, in color, in larger formats? Same for Pro 160NC in 4x5.

Sensia 100 is just the amateur packaging of Provia 100, with a faintly yellower color balance. A nice film, but Provia 100 with an 81A filter will fill that gap.

Tungsten 64 135? It's rare that I shoot under tungsten lights at anything below ISO 1600 these days. If I did, it would be on a tripod, on a larger format than 135. 80A filters still exist. Plus, the EU is going "non-tungsten" for environmental reasons, is it not?

Neopan SS 135 is kind of an emotional loss, though - the last "old-tech" Fuji B&W. We have a dozen rolls on the shelf at the store - sells about 1 roll for every 50 of Plus-X or Tmax 100 or Ilford FP4, even though I try and push it as a creative alternative.

Maybe I'm blasé because when I started shooting (1970), for 35mm color negs, we had a choice of Kodacolor-X or Kodacolor-X. Pros (sheet film) had Vericolor II in daylight or tungsten flavors. Medium format users got the BIG selection - they could pick between Kodacolor or Vericolor. For slides, we had two speeds of Kodachrome, and two of Ektachrome (-X and High Speed (ISO 160)) - only the Ektachromes in MF or sheet film (but with a tungsten option).

There were some marginal players like Ansco and GAF - but Agfa and Fuji didn't exist in the US color market. Somehow we managed to get pictures made.
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Old 08/09/11, 08:53   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

Can't be true. Everyone knows that more and more people are switching to film.

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Old 08/09/11, 08:58   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

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Can't be true. Everyone knows that more and more people are switching to film.

I also write funny remarks when people on the digital forum have a broken or stolen M9. Cheers me up no end - cuz that's the kind of person I am...
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Old 08/09/11, 09:16   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

What? - M2s and M7s are never broken or stolen?

(I take your point - I just think you chose bad examples - cracked sensors or pixel defects might have been better examples of "bad news" exclusive to M9 users )

Last edited by adan; 08/09/11 at 09:19.
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Old 08/09/11, 09:44   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

Andy - incidentally, thanks for your posts. Pretty much all of them, on all of the subsections, could be added to a FAQ for the relevant topic. Posts like yours are what keep me signed-up here. (regrettably, posts like mine hardly add value to the forum, but I just can't resist).

Keep 'em coming!
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Old 08/09/11, 10:45   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

Meh.

As long Fuji keeps making velvia 50, illford their b&w we are all good.

Oh and Kodak isn't going anywhere.
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Old 08/09/11, 12:58   #11 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

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I think unfortunatelyit is only a point of figures. Not enough film sold to justify the production costs. Or selling price should go to high. Not nice but this is the reality of business...
robert, still shooting Provia 100 F ...
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Old 09/09/11, 01:40   #12 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

Well I dont see anything I use either. I dont see it as a sign of the end of film. Companies cut back or stop production of products all the time. If they intend to cut these films in order to try new ones I see it as a good thing.
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Old 09/09/11, 07:58   #13 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

There's bound to be a continuing rationalisation of the choice that's out there, eventually leaving just those that are profitably sustainable. I think there's still a very good variety considering how much the market has shrunk already.
Of course, the elimination of some of the variety will shift the demand to other film types and therefore increase the chances for sustainability of what's left. I guess that argument assumes that the demand does indeed default to other films and not to digital. However, you'd think at this stage that those of us who still primarily use film are pretty rusted on.
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Old 09/09/11, 08:38   #14 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

Please Dear Fuji keep making Neopan 100 Acros ...
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Old 09/09/11, 08:47   #15 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

Indeed, it is inevitable that many films will disappear from the market. I just hope that the gems will stay around. I guess that these market developments will not always happen without pain. We have already seen a beautiful gem disappear from the market completely, i.e. Polaroid Type 55. There is currently no alternative for this one.

Another facet that we should take into account is that the drivers behind Fuji and Kodak in making choices around their film portfolio are quite different then compared to e.g. Ilford and Adox. I would consider Fuji and Kodak films more at risk since these companies are publically owned and have to make significant choices in downsizing their production facility. This is confirmed by their annual reports.

For me personally, as an amateur completely not dependent on any of this, it is interesting to observe how the field innovates and changes. At the same time is depressing to observe that many of these dear tokens that I associate with creativity, beautiful imagery, skills, many joyful moments and wonderful technology are having difficulties.

Cheers,

BJ
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Old 09/09/11, 11:32   #16 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

I dread the day that 35mm slide film is no longer available. It is all I have shot for the last twelve years, and my affection for it now is every bit the same as when I started out using it. IMHO there is nothing to beat a well exposed slide when projected.
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Old 09/09/11, 11:58   #17 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

I share the same fear, long term. I've been shooting slide film virtually exclusively for years and love it. It can't be beat when projected and it scans well too in general.

But I'm encouraged by the fact there's still a good selection of film out there, despite the cutbacks regrettable as they are, and people to develop it as well. It's also still a relatively cheap option, at least here.

Talking of cheap, I recommend trying Agfa Precisa CT100, which is now made in Japan and yields good results, in my experience. Kodak E100G is a good one too, not to mention Fuji Provia 100F of course. They're all different and all have their own virtues.
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Old 09/09/11, 12:00   #18 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

Surely the news that Sensia is no longer being made is old news? It was first announced last year and it seems that in the UK stocks have now run out. Fuji Reala 135 film isn't on the list but I had seen a post from last year (not on this site) which stated that this to was being discontinued as well.
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Old 09/09/11, 12:01   #19 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

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Originally Posted by adan View Post
Maybe I'm blasé because when I started shooting (1970), for 35mm color negs, we had a choice of Kodacolor-X or Kodacolor-X. Pros (sheet film) had Vericolor II in daylight or tungsten flavors. Medium format users got the BIG selection - they could pick between Kodacolor or Vericolor. For slides, we had two speeds of Kodachrome, and two of Ektachrome (-X and High Speed (ISO 160)) - only the Ektachromes in MF or sheet film (but with a tungsten option).

There were some marginal players like Ansco and GAF - but Agfa and Fuji didn't exist in the US color market. Somehow we managed to get pictures made.
Thanks, Adan for this refreshing historical perspective. Yes, history of photography was made with far less emulsions available than are still around today. It's still bad news that more hues are removed from the palette, but I guess for all practical matters we can only hold to your approach.

No more Astia in 120/220 hurts, even if I don't do fashion: I use it at times in a Bronica RF645 and it has a large dynamic range and unique low contrast tones for urban and natural landscapes. Worse, the Astia 135 rolls might then be next in line — and with Asph M-lenses, they are among what 'replaces' late K64 for me in some cases...

Cheers,

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Old 09/09/11, 12:41   #20 (permalink)
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Default Re: This hurts - Fuji is taking more film from the market

Astia 135 has long gone from the European market.

All my stock in the freezer is now way out of date and doesn't give the same result as fresh film.

Pity, as it was my favourite colour film by a long way.
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