M corrections in Adobe Camera Raw

[mtomalty]

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Hi

 

I use,most regularly, Bridge/Camera Raw 4.0.5.11

 

Took a new M out for a spin today with a 21 super elmar.

All files opened with really,nasty vignetting and red edges and corners.

 

As I haven't had this problem with this lens on M9 and M9p was a bit taken aback

In digging around to source the problem I find that Camera Raw does not apply any

profile corrections either by default or when lens is selected manually.

 

Is it logical to assume this version of Bridge/Camera Raw cannot read the in camera corrections

for colorcast,etc even though the DNG is visible complete with preview?

 

Thanks,

Mark

Mark Tomalty Fine Art and Stock Photography

[CheshireCat]

Color cast is corrected in-camera, even if you are shooting DNG. There is no way to specify the required corrections in the DNG.

 

Ensure your camera is configured for automatic lens detection, and that your lens is properly recognized.

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[jaapv]

I suspect the camera did not recognize the lens coding. Check whether it is clean etc.. Or maybe you did not have “automatic” selected. The corrections are applied in the camera before the DNG is written.

Edited February 9, 2014 by jaapv

[250swb]

Hi

 

I use,most regularly, Bridge/Camera Raw 4.0.5.11

 

Bridge is currently version 5.0.2.4 and ACR is version 8.3. Making sure your version of ACR is up to date is a good starting point for trouble shooting, eliminate the easy things first.

 

Steve

[mtomalty]

Thanks for the input.

I understand the the versions of Bridge/Camera Raw are a couple back from the most current.

Unfortunately, an upgrade forces me into the 'cloud' usage agreement with Adobe and is something

I've been avoiding. Looks like the time is now.

 

I also verified and,indeed, lens detection is set properly,in camera,and Bridge recognizes the

files as 21mm 3.4

I should also note that Camera Raw corrections are also not available for my 28,50,and

90 summicrons so it is not lens specific to the 21.

 

I guess my question should have been a little more precise.

The results seen to answer the question for me but not being familiar,beyond the basics, I should

have asked if there are subtle differences in the DNG files between an M9 DNG (which fully embraces

in camera colorcast corrections and Camera Raw lens profile corrections) and an M240 DNG (which

does not apply corrections from either source) that makes then not fully readable in my older version

of Camera Raw/Bridge so far as corrections go.

 

Thanks,

Mark

[CheshireCat]

I also verified and,indeed, lens detection is set properly,in camera,and Bridge recognizes the

files as 21mm 3.4

 

Ensure your M has firmware 2.0.0.11 or newer. It contains bugfixes for in-camera color vignetting correction.

[CheshireCat]

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I should have asked if there are subtle differences in the DNG files between an M9 DNG (which fully embraces in camera colorcast corrections and Camera Raw lens profile corrections) and an M240 DNG (which does not apply corrections from either source)

 

Although there are subtle differences, it is nothing "nasty" (like you said) if you have the proper firmware for the M240.

Also:

- Both cameras perform colorcast correction in-camera.

- Camera Raw does not correct colorcast with any camera.

[hoppyman]

I think that there is some confusion between different types of corrections here.

Your description does suggest that the lens specific corrections were not applied in camera although you mentioned later that you were seeing the lens data in EXIF.

For both DNG and JPEG the camera always applies some level of correction due to the real difficulties inherent in adapting the M lens system to a full frame sensor in the first place.

If the correct lens is identified either by automatic or manual selection there is specific additional correction applied (vignette and 'red edge'/'Italian flag'). It is not aperture specific however. That is to say its effectiveness varies according to aperture.

Your Raw processor can identify the specific lens providing that the data was recorded in EXIF (via detection) but it will only actually apply the ADOBE corrections if those are selected in the Lens correction panel of the Develop Module and then according to the default or your customised settings. Those corrections are separate from anything in camera. Different versions of the Raw processors have differing features there and the current ones are the most comprehensive. They have a lot of other refinements/features too but that is maybe getting off the specific subject. Have to say though that under the current extended arrangements $9.99 a month for Ps and LR with continuous updates is very compelling

Edited February 9, 2014 by hoppyman

[swamiji]

$9.99 per month? Adobe was charging me $29.99 per month! Where did find that arrangement?

[mtomalty]

I think that there is some confusion between different types of corrections here.

Your description does suggest that the lens specific corrections were not applied in camera although you mentioned later that you were seeing the lens data in EXIF.

 

Thx Geoff

 

That was, and is, the case.

In camera corrections relating to colour cast definitely have not been applied .

The specific M240 I used on Saturday is back at the dealers and I will only be able to verify firmware version

tomorrow.

I've shot 1000's of frames with M9's so am pretty familiar with the in camera workings as well as Raw converter options.

 

What I was trying to source out was why Camera Raw will not apply its set of lens profile corrections

(not colour cast) to my M240 DNG's even when I manually choose the appropriate profile.

One thought was my older version of Camera Raw could not FULLY read all embedded data in the M DNG

and thus the previews were not taking advantage of in camera colour cast corrections

 

 

Mark

[wogg]

Any correction Adobe would apply for that lens would be on the assumption *that the in camera correction is already applied*. Their corrections are not a substitution for Leica's but a complement to. Maybe that was already clear, sorry if so.

[hoppyman]

Mark the available lens corrections in Camera Raw or Lightroom are independent from whatever lens/camera is actually used. That is to say you can apply any profile whether or not the brand or model matches or it makes sense.

Those profiles do not include corrections for any the characteristics addressed by the in-camera processing unless you make a custom profile or preset.

However there is a free plug-in available from Adobe labs that can be used

Plug-ins for Adobe Photoshop Lightroom | Adobe Labs

Or you can use a third party program such as the excellent Corner Fix

ChromaSoft: CornerFix

 

I checked for you and the M (Typ 240) DNG has been fully supported from ACR 7.4 and LR 4.4

 

.....................................................

$9.99 per month? Adobe was charging me $29.99 per month! Where did find that arrangement?

Swamiji, Adobe has changed the eligibility for the cheapest subscriptions several times since the introduction. Currently anyone can again obtain Photoshop CC and LR5 for $9.99 with no qualifying earlier licence at all.

Edited February 10, 2014 by hoppyman

[algrove]

OP

If you do not update your ACR very often why not just spend $125 for a boxed version of LR5.x. Soon it might not be available that way.

[hoppyman]

Mark I just glanced at your original post again. As you already have Adobe Camera Raw 4 you can add the point upgrade (to get to 4.4) for free. That is the version fully supporting the M (Typ 240).

 

If you don't want to take up the subscription model, I think that a normal perpetual licence for the current LR version (5.3 right now) is very good value. You have some thousands in high end Leica stuff, another $100 or so to get the best from the files is a good investment, in my opinion.

Even better than that, you would have an entitlement to a perpetual licence for the current version from your Leica M (Typ 240) purchase anyway.

Edited February 10, 2014 by hoppyman

[AlanJW]

The Adobe 9.99 a month deal is for PSCC and Lightroom but no other. The 29.99 gives you all the creative suite apps. For photographers the 9.99 deal is a good deal, especially compared to the cost of upgrading every two years. Now of course the updates are more frequent. I wasn't thrilled with the subscription model but on reflection it is not bad at all.

[chris_tribble]

+1

[xrogers]

$10 a month for PS and LR would be acceptable to me, but that's a limited time intro deal---after a year it goes to $20 a month (until they raise that price), and LR is no longer included (that comes with the full suite at $30 a month).

 

In fact, the only reason I'd upgrade from PS CS5 is camera or OS support, the subsequent versions offer nothing compelling to me. My primary camera is 4 years old---at $240 a year, I'd have paid nearly $1000 so that PS would work with a new camera I bought today.

 

I will avoid the new subscription model as long as possible, hoping they either make the $10/month level stay, or that something new comes along and fills the void.

[algrove]

xrogers

 

Just do not buy a new camera and issue is solved, unless new ACR makes huge strides forward.

[hoppyman]

$10 a month for PS and LR would be acceptable to me, but that's a limited time intro deal---after a year it goes to $20 a month (until they raise that price), and LR is no longer included (that comes with the full suite at $30 a month).

 

In fact, the only reason I'd upgrade from PS CS5 is camera or OS support, the subsequent versions offer nothing compelling to me. My primary camera is 4 years old---at $240 a year, I'd have paid nearly $1000 so that PS would work with a new camera I bought today.

 

I will avoid the new subscription model as long as possible, hoping they either make the $10/month level stay, or that something new comes along and fills the void.

 

No that is not so. As I mentioned earlier the qualifying conditions and package have been changed several times.

LR5 is bundled with PSCC in the $9.99 pm package on a 12 month contract and is now available to anyone whether you have any other Adobe licences or not. The current offer expires at the end of March. There is no statement in the current conditions that the price will be $20 pm after that 12 month period.

If you want more or different apps then the packages are different.

 

If you already have a perpetual licence for an earlier version of PS you can choose to retain that installation separately from the new subscription installation if you want and LR of course remains available under the perpetual licence model plus is bundled with Leica products that way in any case.

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[xrogers]

No that is not so. As I mentioned earlier the qualifying conditions and package have been changed several times.

LR5 is bundled with PSCC in the $9.99 pm package on a 12 month contract and is now available to anyone whether you have any other Adobe licences or not. The current offer expires at the end of March. There is no statement in the current conditions that the price will be $20 pm after that 12 month period.

If you want more or different apps then the packages are different.

 

Terms and conditions

 

From the Adobe terms on the offer:

 

… Offer valid for purchases of an annual plan, which requires a 12-month contract. … After the first 12 months, we will automatically renew your contract based on the current price of the offering. ...

 

The current price of PS alone is 19.99 a month, and LR is only included with the full CC subscription at 29.99 a month.