Color conversion to B&W in Photoshop

[johnwolf]

I thought I knew all the Photoshop techniques to convert color to B&W, but Shutterbug just published one I'd never heard of. Maybe it's widely know, but it's new to me. I generally use the Channel Mixer method, but often find it hard to get good tonal range without blowing highlights. This technique seems subtler to me.

1. Open a color image
2. Add a Hue/Saturation layer with blend mode Color
3. Add another Hue/Saturation layer with Saturation -100 (blend mode Normal)
4. To adjust BW tonal distribution, vary the Hue slider in the first Hue/Saturation layer

Just thought I'd pass it along.

John

[woodyspedden]

Originally Posted by johnwolf

I thought I knew all the Photoshop techniques to convert color to B&W, but Shutterbug just published one I'd never heard of. Maybe it's widely know, but it's new to me. I generally use the Channel Mixer method, but often find it hard to get good tonal range without blowing highlights. This technique seems subtler to me.

1. Open a color image
2. Add a Hue/Saturation layer with blend mode Color
3. Add another Hue/Saturation layer with Saturation -100 (blend mode Normal)
4. To adjust BW tonal distribution, vary the Hue slider in the first Hue/Saturation layer

Just thought I'd pass it along.

John

John

Neat trick. I'll have to keep this one in mind.

Woody Spedden

[arminw]

Interesting technique I must remember that. Thanks for sharing !!

[chris_tribble]

Thanks too - though what I've been finding is that the black and white conversion in Lightroom or Photoshop CS3 beta are the best things I've every used. It's misleadingly called grayscale conversion in Lightoom - don't be deceived, there are amazingly flexible ways of toning and grading the output. Very satisfying.

While on the subject of B&W output - does anyone have any tips on using QuadTone RIP? It's strongly recommended by people I respect on this list (including Sean) but I can only get it to produce stripes or black pages on my Epson 2100.

Thank for any comments.

Chris

[WPalank]

Originally Posted by chris_tribble

does anyone have any tips on using QuadTone RIP? It's strongly recommended by people I respect on this list (including Sean) but I can only get it to produce stripes or black pages on my Epson 2100.Chris

Chris, there is a very active QuadToneRIP Yahoo Group where the developer, Roy Harrington, comes on board quite often to answer questions. You can find it here:
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/QuadtoneRIP/

[cocker]

Originally Posted by chris_tribble

Thanks too - though what I've been finding is that the black and white conversion in Lightroom or Photoshop CS3 beta are the best things I've every used. It's misleadingly called grayscale conversion in Lightoom - don't be deceived, there are amazingly flexible ways of toning and grading the output. Very satisfying.

While on the subject of B&W output - does anyone have any tips on using QuadTone RIP? It's strongly recommended by people I respect on this list (including Sean) but I can only get it to produce stripes or black pages on my Epson 2100.

Thank for any comments.

Chris

Chris,

You must convert the tif to greyscale (8 bit as well probably but not sure on that one). If you leave it as an RGB file you will use a lot of black ink!

Best wishes

[Kirk]

If you really want to control B&W conversion, download the new Photoshop CS3 public beta. It has a new B&W conversion that lets you adjust each color to alter the grayscale tone and appearance.

[fotografz]

When converting a couple hundred wedding files to B&W all those techniques make me want to kill myself.

Then I discovered the Gradient Map in PS. One click, done.

Maps the tonal scale to avoid blown highlights and avoids blocked shadows. Slight adjust to taste from there, but usually not necessary.

[cmb_]

Originally Posted by johnwolf

I thought I knew all the Photoshop techniques to convert color to B&W, but Shutterbug just published one I'd never heard of. Maybe it's widely know, but it's new to me. I generally use the Channel Mixer method, but often find it hard to get good tonal range without blowing highlights. This technique seems subtler to me.

1. Open a color image
2. Add a Hue/Saturation layer with blend mode Color
3. Add another Hue/Saturation layer with Saturation -100 (blend mode Normal)
4. To adjust BW tonal distribution, vary the Hue slider in the first Hue/Saturation layer

Just thought I'd pass it along.

John

I believe this was developed by Russell Brown. Here are 2 good tutorials demonstrating the technique from the Adobe site:
http://www.adobe.com/designcenter/ph...s8colorbw.html

Adobe - Design Center : Photoshop in black and white

I think there is a Quicktime demo on his site: The Russell Brown Show
Lots of neat stuff.

[stnami]

CS3 has made that process redundant with its new B&W conversion, convert to LAB colour space for further corrections in curves, this reduces any dependancy on Unsharp Mask

[WPalank]

Originally Posted by stnami

CS3 has made that process redundant with its new B&W conversion, convert to LAB colour space for further corrections in curves, this reduces any dependancy on Unsharp Mask

Im,how does the LAB colorspace "reduce dependancy on Unsharp mask"? In other words, how would working with the curves (which I would assume reduce or increase contrast of the image) effect the sharpness? That being said, do you work globally in LAB or just the L (Lightness) channel? This is where I have been taught to use unsharp mask so that there is a reduction of noise and/or artifact.

Given the wonderful B&W work on your website, I am all ears! Also, sign me up for any tutorials you might present on B&W conversion. Cheers!

[chris_tribble]

Originally Posted by cocker

Chris,

You must convert the tif to greyscale (8 bit as well probably but not sure on that one). If you leave it as an RGB file you will use a lot of black ink!

Best wishes

Thanks to all who have responded. A couple of thoughts.

1/ Sorry - can't agree on converting to "real" greyscale (as opposed to Lightroom's take on this) prior to printing - all tonality goes...

2/ I think the real problem was not having converted to 8 bit. CS handles this fine, the RIP doesn't seem to

3/ I've got it working fine now - VERY good control on tonality with my Epson Photo 2100 - lovely neutral prints without a hint of metamerism under a wide range of lights.

4/ thanks for the suggestion of the link to the QuadTone Yahoo group - I also got some helpful responses for the nice people out there.

So now I can add my endorsement to those of others for QuadTone RIP - an excellent and very generously supported resource for anyone with Epson printers.

Best

Chris

[johnwolf]

Thanks, everyone, for responding to the initial post. I wasn't seeking a response -- just wanted to share a technique that is new to me. But, as usual, much good information from an enthusiastic and informed group.

John

[stnami]

William

Im,how does the LAB colorspace "reduce dependancy on Unsharp mask"?

... jpegs usually have enough or even too much camera inhouse sharpening.
LAB does enough to bolster the tone especially when the high and low ends are altered. I usually leave the mid tones alone as cameras are quite accurate in their recording and playing around with them usually flattens the image. Sure some sharpening is needed with raw images, and I would prefer to do this in LAB (PHOTOKIT SHARPENER LISTEN PLEASE), but once the tone are up and the dynamic range compressed little is needed. I used to use Unsharp mask extensively but hardly ever now,usually spot sharpening via PK if any

work globally in LAB or just the L (Lightness) channel?

.. using Raw Developer (mac) gives me the chance to use LAB curves from the beginning. really helpful with colour work. Some images needing B&W conversion from colour and are somewhat flat I will tweak in LAB - Lightness, A and B then convert to B&W via gradient,flatten tweak in LAB and so on...
I am happy to use Lightroom, Raw Developer, LightZone, CS2/3, Alien Skin's Exposure, any thing and I treat each image individually, all by eye as I gave up using numbers. I gave up most of my commercial work, except for images of landscaped Gardens for a few larger companies who know me and leave me be. This means I have no deadlines and can do as I please as all work is gallery based.
Images are converted to Tiff 16-8 for printing and then discarded once a print is made, thus there can be variations to a single image, stored as DNG or RAW takes less space and places flexibility to the forefront.
I can be contacted via my web site.. if anyone is interested