Personal conclusion

[andym911]

So after months of deliberation and weeks of anxiety I finally made a decision yesterday.

This morning I cancelled my order for the M8 and spent 4k on Canon DSLR and lenses.A sad day and a great day.
Why?
I own and shoot lots with M series (m6/m7) and was looking for a fast track to delivering the goods to customers, e.g digital.
Got tired of scanning 200 or 300 negs for a wedding and all of the PP required and even though I run just a small photo business the time factor was beginning to get out of hand.
So the solution was an M8, or so I thought.
I do not claim to be the best PP around and some of the jargon on this forum makes me shudder at what I apparently still have to learn.
But I thought there's about 12k in M lenses here so stick an M8 on the end and problem solved.
However all of the 'stuff' that I hear here and the apparent work required to get good images in PP made me worry, following the posts from Pro's here got me more worried, seeing the reaction (or lack of it) from Leica got me even more worried, seeing the vast quantity of images posted here with either issues or just demonstrating 'normal digicam shots' got me more worried and finaly a call to my dealer, who I trust immensely , nailed it.
I want an M8, I ordered an M8 , I dream of an M8........but my customers don't.

They want balanced color, predictable results, fair pricing, and above all they want commitment from me.It became clear to me that with an M8 I cannot give them that, today.
One day I will buy an M9 or whatever the next gen. M digital will be called but today there is only one person who would be fascinated and awed with the current product and that would be me. To buy it under that premise would be wrong.

I take my hat off to those of you who are persevering and striving to make ' the bloody thing work' and am sure you will in the end.
I have learnt so much here from you and will continue to do so, but for me my personal conclusion is shoot leica for film, which I do with passion (if not competence) and shoot digital with another brand who have the experience and know how for today's needs.

This 'virtual love affair' for me has been extremely valuable, I now relish even more my quiet , silent M6, and am looking forward to loading it up with some grainy stuff tomorrow.My newly aquired Canon sits there, no emotion, no adoration but I know on Tuesday when I shoot at an appointment that what comes out is what the customer expects, and I won't be up half the night 'sorting it'.
Next year maybe.........

Kind Regards

Andy

[andym911]

And BTW if anyone needs a 46mm 486 IR Cut filter in CHROME I have one.Will sell at cost plus shipping
andy

[xxl-user]

congratulations, andy!

you are really a pro who wants to deliver best quality to his clients and not just a leica fool!

just look here: *professional m8* and you know your decision was right!

arnold

[reven]

Yes everyone has to decide what he wants... So that is your choise and it is fine. I chose diffrently I sold my second 5D because I knew I will not need it any more ... why ? because I have ssen what the M8 can do and that I really prefer it to my 5d...

[andym911]

Christopher,

I wish you the best, out of curiosity are you hobby or pro or somewhere in between?
I think this is interesting and important to know for others as if I was pure hobby I KNOW I would have gone the M8 route.

cheers

andy

[reven]

I'm studing fine art at university in London, but besides that I do lot's of work for diffrent clients in Germany and it's good money. Perhaps the reaseon for my decision was that I alway got an 1DsMk2 and a 5D for wildlife and sports shooting. So going with a M8 for Urban and travelling shooting is the best I think. That's the camera is really made for.

[reven]

I also want to ad. I love Leica, but sorry but I would never only work with them without a Canon or similiar. That's perhaps because I really need that autofocus. So if I just have to pick one camera I would always choose my 1DsMk2 again.

[frc]

I second your reason not to buy. I'm often in difficult light-situations and therefor have no faith in the M8's capacities. In another thread the same thoughts are expressed.
Being somewhere between hobby and pro I can somtimes mess about but often find myself being very dependent.
( ;Sorry people, do you mind a few green blobs in the picture -)

[tashley]

Originally Posted by andym911

And BTW if anyone needs a 46mm 486 IR Cut filter in CHROME I have one.Will sell at cost plus shipping
andy

Andy, I'll have that filter, just tell me what to do! I think it fits a 50mm 1.4...

tim@timashley.com

Tim

[fotografz]

In reference to Guy's thread that was linked here: no one that's hasn't been on the job and had this happen to them can fully appreciate what it feels like. Been there done that, and know the feeling.

I'm doing a "partial M8 wedding" tomorrow, and I'm fully backed up with my M7 for that kind of rangefinder stuff ... not because I don't trust the M8, but because I don't trust any new electronic based gear ... for a long time.

It's just part of the process.

Yesterday I was prepping the H2D for the formal wedding work and it went south on me.
The rep showed up today with a loaner and took mine, (it turned out to be a stupid firewire cable, but I sent it for a upgrade to a H3D anyway).

Pros like Guy need that sort of support.

Best of luck.

[guy_mancuso]

Originally Posted by fotografz

In reference to Guy's thread that was linked here: no one that's hasn't been on the job and had this happen to them can fully appreciate what it feels like. Been there done that, and know the feeling.

I'm doing a "partial M8 wedding" tomorrow, and I'm fully backed up with my M7 for that kind of rangefinder stuff ... not because I don't trust the M8, but because I don't trust any new electronic based gear ... for a long time.

It's just part of the process.

Yesterday I was prepping the H2D for the formal wedding work and it went south on me.
The rep showed up today with a loaner and took mine, (it turned out to be a stupid firewire cable, but I sent it for a upgrade to a H3D anyway).

Pros like Guy need that sort of support.

Best of luck.

Thanks Marc i could not agree with you more and fortunetly i have the DMR to back me up . But mild heart attack when it happens is a under statement and i also agree not so much the M8 but anything can happen to anything at any given moment. It scares me to death when i hear some folks do a wedding with one 20d body. There out of there minds to trust anything to luck. i also call that stupidity but that is another thread.

In all honesty i need leica to jump to the plate here

[andym911]

FYI

486 Filter has a new home..a salivating early adopter.
andy

[tashley]

I'm not salivating I'm drooling... the Holy Grail of an IR cut filter so I don't have to engage in a tweakathon with every file... Now just got to figure out which ICC profile to use when shot with the filter in that PIG of a piece of software called C1. Wonder what the C stands for? Oh yes, Capture, that's right...

:-)

Tim

[Jamie Roberts]

Originally Posted by andym911

{snipped} My newly aquired Canon sits there, no emotion, no adoration but I know on Tuesday when I shoot at an appointment that what comes out is what the customer expects, and I won't be up half the night 'sorting it'.
Next year maybe.........
Andy

Andy--it's funny we came to exactly opposite conclusions about the M8.

My customers will appreciate the better prints, the better corrected distortions in the wide angles, the continuous shooting without banding (yes, the 5d can do that--watch for magnetic fields and continuous AF) and the ability to print and crop, um, big .

I also know they'll appreciate me getting more relaxed shots of the guests.

But this sounds more argumentative than I want it to: your decisions sounds good for you. It's just that as a Canon shooter, and a pro, I came to a completely different conclusion after working with the M8.

Having said that, I have a 5d as a backup. When my DMR battery (not the camera) went south at a wedding a couple of weeks ago I was happy to have the 5d ready to shoot.

[Jamie Roberts]

Originally Posted by tashley

I'm not salivating I'm drooling... the Holy Grail of an IR cut filter so I don't have to engage in a tweakathon with every file... Now just got to figure out which ICC profile to use when shot with the filter in that PIG of a piece of software called C1. Wonder what the C stands for? Oh yes, Capture, that's right...

:-)

Tim

Tim--try the new C1 M8 profile first, of course; I've heard they've upgraded it in 3.6.

No offense meant, either, but what do you have against C1? It's hardly bloated compared to some, um, other image editors we all know and love

[andym911]

Originally Posted by Jamie Roberts

I also know they'll appreciate me getting more relaxed shots of the guests.

But this sounds more argumentative than I want it to: your decisions sounds good for you. It's just that as a Canon shooter, and a pro, I came to a completely different conclusion after working with the M8.

Having said that, I have a 5d as a backup. When my DMR battery (not the camera) went south at a wedding a couple of weeks ago I was happy to have the 5d ready to shoot.

Jamie,
no worries on the argumentative stuff.....I will continue to get the realxed shots of the guests as you mention using the M6/M7...a crucial piece of the job, but, I need the fast processing of numerous 'other shots' in digital and this is where I see the Canon delivering.I had hoped to be able to cover with one system but have decided that 'each to their own' is the best path forward.

I do appreciate your insights and follow your posts with interest so no worries here..it is just a small insignificant decision on my part(compared to what really matters)

andy

[tashley]

Originally Posted by Jamie Roberts

Tim--try the new C1 M8 profile first, of course; I've heard they've upgraded it in 3.6.

No offense meant, either, but what do you have against C1? It's hardly bloated compared to some, um, other image editors we all know and love

Hi Jamie,

First, thanks for all your incredibly generous work on profiles - they have saved me work and heartache and I love your chrome one in particular. There are so many negative old sods around that someone who just rolls up their sleeves and gets on with it is a true pleasure. The force be with you!

Now, firstly, is the new C1 profile easy to find?

Secondly, my Capture One issue is in comparison to Lightroom. Curses to it for not allowin selection of ICC profiles but in every other way (almost) it is a joy. No instruction manual, no need. Archiving, tagging, searching, developing (with easy cut and paste of settings from one file to a batch) and good easy printing. You gotta love it.

C1 as it turns out does have many of these abilities but boy do you have to dig! I find the pasting of settings counter intuitive because it's badly covered in Help, and does not allow sufficiently positive selection of source and target for paste settings. I also think the three tab edit is a real pain. Lightroom is so much faster at this stuff, especially beta four, where colour corrections and blacks/highlight recovery etc are so intuitive - even if the NR sucks.

BTW the version of C1 that ships with an M8 is now pretty much redundant in the world of with/without IR cut, because selecting and ICC profile can only be done globally rather than per picture. The upgrade is very expensive but realistically there's no choice unless some clever chap (? ! ) can translate their profiles into Camera Calibration presets for Lightroom... but that really would be asking too much.

Thanks for everything, again. There's a silent crowd of grateful people out there...

Tim

Well done andy, you´re a pro who accept only the best quality and NOT these problems with magenta, IR-filter, special softwareprofiles, banding, defects....and yor´re no "leica-fashion-victim" .......
I hope the M8.2 (?) will be a better camera.
Kind regards Tom

[Jean LeBlanc]

Originally Posted by andym911

So after months of deliberation and weeks of anxiety I finally made a decision yesterday.

This morning I cancelled my order for the M8 and spent 4k on Canon DSLR and lenses.A sad day and a great day.

Yup. There is so much that's new about the M8, that even if these initial problems hadn't reared their ugly heads, I wouldn't be comfortable using it for time critical work until after the thing had been out and used for a good six months or so. As it is I've got a full Canon kit for my work and I can afford to play with the M8 with all my old lenses, and I will as soon as the bugs are fixed. But I won't be counting on it for quite some time. I can count on the 5D.

[Riley]

Originally Posted by leicafan100

Well done andy, you´re a pro who accept only the best quality and NOT these problems with magenta, IR-filter, special softwareprofiles, banding, defects....and yor´re no "leica-fashion-victim" .......
I hope the M8.2 (?) will be a better camera.
Kind regards Tom

you probably need to see this thread

http://www.leica-camera-user.com/dig...king-test.html

Riley