M8 Detail,Dynamic Range and Color

[guy_mancuso]

Alright just went out in the brightest sun in probably the US and just went to a little cowboy town north of me. Just wanted to see what i judge a camera on and Dynamic range is the biggy, sharpness and color. Well color i am still working on that but it is not bad . now i have shot digital only for the last 12 years or so and owned quite a few DSLR's including Kodak, Nikon and Canon and the last 20 months I believe . I sold everything for the DMR after i tested it in these kinds of conditions and if it can cut the mustard with DR and sharpness and such. Now i still consider when it comes to the bottom line image , that it is the best around in the 35mm market. So in comes the M8 can it even come close to what i have already have. Sharpness i have to say look out the detail in the M8 is amazing and these jpegs don't even come close to showing how sharp the M line is. Dynamic range this is a tough one becuase it depends on processing and what lens and all that so what i do is do nothing to the raw files just process them to give me a rough idea. Color , anything that even resembles Kodachrome and i am on it like no ones business. the DMR has proved it simply puts out great color. The M8 looks to me it will when we get profiles they way we want. Following are just some quick shots walking around ,artistically they stink but more to the point they give us some idea what these files can do and can't do. Let's begin

Let me through in a disclaimer here. i do not work for Leica or make a nickel about posting on the internet. I do this to help others make informed decisions and also it is a work in progress for me. If you have noticed i explore something from the beginning to the end and see what makes these things tick. If you go buy one , sell one , send it back, don't buy one or frankly eat one. I really don't care, it is your money and do with it what you want. I don't care if your a pro or a rookie at this but I like to make this fun and that is what it is all about. If i did not make this stuff fun i would have burned out years ago so after a 32 year career i still get excited about this stuff . so if you think this stuff is pushing it down your throat it is not my intention but like a kid in a candy store i still like to enjoy myself . Okay on to some images

[guy_mancuso]

Watch the sharpness but really watch the shadows on how open they are

[guy_mancuso]

Having trouble uploading

[guy_mancuso]

Couple more

[guy_mancuso]

Shots like this one give me lot's of valuable info. Look at the shadow side , this is a lot of stops from the light side but i can read the sign and see into the shadows.

[guy_mancuso]

Last 2 . get some ideas on how the files look

[erl]

Guy,
I agree the shadows and sharpness appear great despite the web repro. Re the colour. If I interpret your preceeding comment correctly you have done NO colour correction on these images. Is that right? I see yellow and maybe a bit of green in some of them, which one assumes will be fixed in updrade/profiles etc. Only you can comment on the colour fidelity compared to the original, but maybe that was not your primary exercise here.

Cheers,
Erl

[davidada]

Guy, without a doubt the M8 files are killers, that's what I think, if you don't want the camera no one is forcing you to buy one , we are going to see some great images from the M8, enough so that it should end the digital/film debate.

[robertwright]

the vingnetting and cyan corners are all under control. What is going on here? IR filtration or no?

..heart skips a beat

...now if they were only in stock...

[butchhul]

Greetings,

Could you share a bit more info? Are these all from a single lens or various ones, if so which ones?
Are any filters, IR or other involved? Straight files or post production with C1 or other software?
Recorded as JPEG or DNG files?

Please accept my thanks for all of the information and material you have previously shared on the forum.

Sincerely,
Butch Hulett

[guy_mancuso]

Yes some are shot with the 50 lux which has the filter one . The 21mm still waiting on filters and the bear is the C/V 15mm along with the air conditioner side of hut shot. Not great shots becuase i am looking at shadows and details to see what is going on. I agree David these files are hot stuff and i am really taken with this style of shooting. Once we get our profiles sorted out and get more out of the box images coming from the raw procesors it will be beterr. i simply can't go in and correct the yellow without globally affect something else it maybe too much of a move right now. but again this is how we started with the DMR and as raw developers came on board like C1 and raw developer we really starting getting outstanding color. Like I said i am a Kodachrome freak and have not shot film since they
took it away. I am the classic from the song. I am still mad at Kodak.


Alright the wife is hounding me,catch you later

[erl]

I have had my M8 for 6 days now. Only had time to 'play' with it for 2 of those days. Attached is a pic I took of my dog Merlin, the GSD, playing with Archie, the Golen retiever.

M8 + f2.0/90mm set at f4. Shutter @ 1/725 ISO 320, DNG original. Full frame image.

Processed in C1 LE using Jamie's 'fixed' profile.

I reckon the clarity and shadow depth is amazing. The light was very contrasty and made me squint, but this combo cut through it all. No filter (yet!).

Cheers,
Erl

[sean_reid]

Hi Guy,

As with the R-D1, the contrast of the lens being used on the M8 will have a noticeable effect on effective DR. Thanks, as always, for the threads and examples and for making me LOL with "If you go buy one , sell one , send it back, don't buy one or frankly eat one. I really don't care, it is your money and do with it what you want."

Best,

S

[rick123]

Hi Sean,

What is your experience using the 50mm f/1.4 lens with/without IR filter? Thanks!

Rick

[guy_mancuso]

Here is a 75 cron that i shot today with the filter

[guy_mancuso]

Little on the yellow side

[carstenw]

A little hot on the shirt in places. Can you get some detail back there? What about in the shadows of her hair?

[fotografz]

Well, I'm sure the "buy one, don't buy one, etc.", comment is aimed at me a little bit ... LOL.

Yet, I notice it's the same handful of enthusiasts going on and on about this camera as it were the second coming. To be admired I'm sure, but also to be taken with a grain of salt when you consider the price tag both in money, inconvenience and ancillary user fixes needed.

So, I'll persist with acting as a counter point to assertions that IMO I find to be a bit over the top. NOT that I don't like the M8 and the entire M line up ... I've invested more in M gear over 30 years of consistently shooting Leica than most, and even once had a $200,000 collection of rare Leicas which, to the horror of other collectors, I actually used!

I respect the opinions and work of Guy, Sean and others here. David's printing skills are not to be questioned IMO. But I also respect my own experiences and those of the professional photographers I have had the good fortune to work with in my 40 year advertising career. As a designer, art director and creative director, I'll hazard a guess that I've bought more photography of more types than any one here ... and could name drop until Hell froze over.

Most of the assertions seemed based on a certain image criteria that some, but not all, subscribe to. Guy's love of Kodachrome is pretty revealing of that criteria. Digital smoothness being one of those attributes. This is one of the aspects of digital that has given rise to the "it's better than scanned MF film".

However, contrary to David's assertion that this should put an end to the digital verses film debate ... I continue to assert that it is NOT a contest because it is an apples to oranges comparison. They are two different ways to make photographs each with it's own set of charms and draw backs. I personally find it terrific that we as artists have a selection to draw from depending on our artistic objectives.

But if we must persist in using that criteria, I'll play a bit ... there is nothing shown here that one couldn't reproduce with one roll of film in an M7. Not only produce, but do it with more latitude and dynamic range. And in the case of the portrait do it with much better skin texture, tones and color ... while holding shadow detail in the hair and maintaining the highlight detail in the blouse.

Does this make me a digital-phobic throwback? I hope not since I have dropped the equivalent amount of cash in commercial digital capture to have paid for a place in the Hamptons... or a Aston Martin Vanquish S. That, my friends, is dedication to digital.

Why the counter-point opinion? Because this is NOT a cut and dry decision for most.
I personally have listened to seemingly unshakeable positives from very respected photographers, and seen others follow their lead ... only to have those opinion leaders suddenly change course. Few photographers could have been more of a Leica M supporter than the wedding photographer Jeff Ascough. He evangelized the M to no end, then suddenly abandoned it all for Canon DSLRs, and claims he'll never look back.

Over enthusiastic support of anything is what leads to overlooking the obvious. With-in two days of general distribution of the M8 all the glaring flaws missed by Beta testers were discovered by early adopters.

So, IMO consider with caution. This is not a film Leica that proved to hold it's value for decades. Be satisfied with it as it is, because it will be different in very short order. Those of us that make money with cameras can absorb the shock of digital depreciation, to others it is simply a loss.

As far as FUN is concerned, I don't consider working through a manufacturers problems to be fun. Shooting without concern to the gear is what defines FUN to me.

[MarkM6]

Originally Posted by carstenw

A little hot on the shirt in places...

I was in Arizona for the first time; at previous time, I drove pass it on my way to Austin, Texas, years ago. I find it quite difficult to shot there because the sun is so intense. But the sun rise and sun set are beautiful.

Guy is in Arizona and the pictures he posted above above do have that "Arizona Signature."

[newyorkone]

Guy,

The DR on these shots is amazing. My 5D doesn't handle bright sun half as good.

Which shot did you take with the 21 ASPH? Thanks.