Keh?

[jaapv]

I'm trying to order an 105-280 from KEH.
After three days the order was still pending, so I called them

"Yes Sir, there are some problems, firstly the shipping is expensive, so we are awaiting an answer to our mail."
OK, it is probbly hung up in some spam filter on the way, so send it.
"Secondly it is an expensive item, so we don't take European credit cards, we want a wire transfer."
??These are either Visa or Amex, issued directly by the CC company, not through a bank.
" Yes, but in case of a dispute it is difficult for us"
What dispute? I understand your stuff is as advertised, plus a wire transfer removes all my customer protection.This is a civilized country with laws.I'm sure however, we can work something out.
"That is fine ,Sir, please mail the salesperson handling the order, his e-mail adress is..."
Two days later, still no mail. I will call them Monday morning, as I really want that lens.
Now if this were an e-bay transaction, I would run from it as fast as I can. But I understand this is a very reputable store, so I'll probably do the wire transfer.
Any thoughts???

[spylaw4]

Personally, Jaap, I would follow the eBay example! Shop elsewhere in this instance.

[Photoskeptic]

Jaap, I've never had a problem with KEH and found them a terrific company to deal with. However, since you are a furriner, it may be an entirely different situation. If you really, really want that lens then I would abide by their policy or look elsewhere.

[peter_n]

I believe they will not take credit cards from outside the US. I don't know if they'll take PayPal but they probably will. It's pretty mainstream these days. If you have a PayPal a/c and they take it you can then handle the PayPal transaction with your credit card.

[sam3lindsey]

I have bought items from KEH for years and even sold them some things -- absolutely great people. Don't know why you have had the problem.

[bill]

Get used to it, Jaap, as far as KEH are concerned you are a dodgy rogue in a third world country, and plainly not to be trusted.

This would fit in the "can't be arsed" box for me. Find another supplier who actually wants to do business.

Regards,

Bill

[jaapv]

Anyway, it is very simple. No way am I going to buy an used item over the Internet at 3000$ and do a wire transfer, no matter the reputation of the seller. Even if it is impeccable, what about loss or damage in transit?

[lct]

Most US sellers i'm used to deal with accept credit cards if EU buyers send them a copy of the latters by fax or email previously. Now when you pay with a credit card, sellers always wait to receive the funds before shipping items so your risk is the same as with wire/bank transfers unless your bank (or insurer) cover the shipping risk when you pay with a credit card but are you sure of that?

[smokysun]

i've bought tons of stuff from them (and returned some things too). never had a problem. salespeople always helpful. returns can be a bit slow on the refund, but they always come through. no better prices anywhere i've found, except a couple times on ebay. try a call to a different salesperson or ask for the manager.

[jaapv]

A wire transfer is irrevokable. Credit card companies offer some protection.

[lct]

Originally Posted by jaapv

A wire transfer is irrevokable. Credit card companies offer some protection.

What protection?

[jaapv]

The option to dispute. And 160 days insurance on all purchases.

[lct]

Originally Posted by jaapv

The option to dispute. And 160 days insurance on all purchases.

Jaap, question is to know if your insurance covers shipping risks actually.

[jaapv]

Loss, stolen, damaged.

[storybrown]

I've gotten good Leica things at good prices from KEH & had some problems, too. You think something is done & it isn't, & you don't find out until you finally ask what's up.

Little to do with where you are, really; they're equally good/bad for everybody, anywhere. They're better on the phone (their phone crowd & online crowd are in disjunctive orbits, I gather) & after you've bought from them before.

I would say bear with them. Stay in email contact with your KEH phone contact as you go. They will gradually come thru OK, and get better from there. That's the track record I have from them, in any case -- course, I haven't yet bought any wunnerful $3K lenses thru them . . .

[glenerrolrd]

KEH is highly reliable in most instances. They are a small privately owned business in Atlanta. I am looking for the owners name...Grant...... They must have had some problems with their international sales or the cost maybe too much. The buyer protection is certainly worth going after. You might try calling AMEX. I have bought and sold things thru KEH for probably 30 years. There whole business model is buy low, grade hard and sell at a fair price. Great to buy from ...

[zapp]

Originally Posted by jaapv

I'm trying to order an 105-280 from KEH.
After three days the order was still pending, so I called them

"Yes Sir, there are some problems, firstly the shipping is expensive, so we are awaiting an answer to our mail."
OK, it is probbly hung up in some spam filter on the way, so send it.
"Secondly it is an expensive item, so we don't take European credit cards, we want a wire transfer."
??These are either Visa or Amex, issued directly by the CC company, not through a bank.
" Yes, but in case of a dispute it is difficult for us"
What dispute? I understand your stuff is as advertised, plus a wire transfer removes all my customer protection.This is a civilized country with laws.I'm sure however, we can work something out.
"That is fine ,Sir, please mail the salesperson handling the order, his e-mail adress is..."
Two days later, still no mail. I will call them Monday morning, as I really want that lens.
Now if this were an e-bay transaction, I would run from it as fast as I can. But I understand this is a very reputable store, so I'll probably do the wire transfer.
Any thoughts???

Who ever defined what a civilized country actually is?
Same thing is happening with almost almost all decent US shops lately. B&H, Adorama, ... the simple message is that only American credit card are good. What do you expect from a country where check writing is still state of the art and where you need 5 IDs to get into a bar???

[jaapv]

Well, since I seem to be an untrustworthy furriner I've decided to cancel the order, especially as there still is no e-mail... There are more of these lenses for sale. My hangup is, if you are so xenophobic, why deal on the Internet at all? And a real thank-you to those that PM-ed me. That was really helpful

[peter_n]

Jaap I don't think it's xenophobia. I've personally never dealt with KEH, but my understanding from others is that KEH have suffered enough losses from credit card "purchases" emanating from outside the US that they are not prepared to do it any more.

What is missing from their site is a "terms & conditions" page where this is made explicit, with a link to it on every sales page and an acknowledgement checkbox that you have read it before you can click the Purchase button. Then you might still think you're being discriminated against but you wouldn't have suffered half the aggravation.

[jaapv]

Well, right, I can sympathize with that to a certain extent, but it is not like I'm asking them to send it to Nigeria. When contacted they could have asked for a reference, I do know a few of their regular customers that would have been a character witness for me.