What is Leica doing to attract ...

[stnami]

Companies make money out of the masses not individuals, so phone, music,fashion companies target the young and stereotype the product and intended market by creating a culture.
Individuals unfortunately will be short changed whether you are 19 or 91 as their needs are not on a company's financial agenda, If you personally want to be catered for expect to pay out lots of hard earned cash, the "I want but I can't pay" ain't gonna cut it
Leica doesn't give a hoot about those without money in fact no company wants to work on a loss. If you want a Leica digital M and mum and dad are cashed up then you are on easy street if not you will have to earn it like most of us.
Not many students (17-25) in the photo/ graphics workshops I run know what a Leica is let alone its value, they say 'ahum' and get on with it . Despite that they produce amazing and innovative stuff with all sorts of bits and pieces of technology combining the new with the relevent old, it's the content that matters
With the new forms of communication photography is fast losing its visual dominance and impact so the new technologies are coming into their own, even Magnum, NG etc no longer rely on the still image alone, a facinating future
"Some people would have come straight at you with a lighter and aerosol can instead of trying to stay civil, if you know what I mean". to what avail?
We all belong to a tribe one way or another and that places us odds with others, right now money talks and runs the show. no money no go

[frc]

Perhaps it is not Leica who is to attract young people, perhaps we, the users are the ones that should take that task upon us. Without any intension to drag him into it I noticed my son, now 15 years of age, rejects my Nikon D70 S, and is now continuously asksing me if he can use my MP. His first shots he made years ago with an old voigtlaender Vito gave him a clue of exposure vs. aperture, DOF, contrast etc. His first questions about the D70S were about how to overrule the automation, he was shocked he had to use weels on the body to set aperture and time. Wrong place, all plastic, garbage.
He's now saving money to buy himself a secondhand M6. I promiced him to the use of some of my lenses. BTW he just puchased an I-pod nano. ( couldn't do without )


all will end well


Fr.

[stnami]

Pretty much as well agree on that Leica produce cameras, yet to see one give birth to a photographer.
In the workshops I bridge the wet and dry darkrooms, manual and auto, computer and smelly fingers. Works well

[Angora]

Originally Posted by martinb

Just have a question. Could young people afford Leica bodies and lenses 20 years ago? Did you have a Leica when you was 20, Chris?
But hey, I'm hooked on Leica and I'm 21. But I think that Leica have turned out to be more luxury items than back in the day.
Unfortunately the price gap between Leica and other gear is growing bigger. Especially the lens prices which is the biggest investment.

On the other side, and fortunately for us (I'm 21 too), prices of lenses dropped on the second hand market.

[Angora]

Originally Posted by overgaardcom

I plan to do a online 'photo school' that will guide from A-B telling which films I use and why, how to scan, how to calibrate a screen, how to sharpen a picture, how to select what to scan, how to remove dirt from a scan and all those details that make a final picture. It has to be easy and applicable. That's just my thing becuause I realized I might as well give the few tricks I learned the hard way, in an easy way.

Would be strongly interested !

[robert_parker]

James

Too right - there'll always be room for excellence and people who are inspired by owning it...

[thomasmartinledford]

Leica does offer a student discount program which is how I purchased a lens after I started photo school. Eberhard and Mary Jo Kuehne are good contacts (at least in Southern California). You can reach them at loveleica@aol.com. Good luck.

[haris]

Originally Posted by Angora

On the other side, and fortunately for us (I'm 21 too), prices of lenses dropped on the second hand market.

But, secondhand market doesn't do anything to Leica as manufacturer, they don't get money when you buy on secondhand market...

[albertwang]

The student discount program isn't going to help Leica brand their image to the youth out there. They really need to have some brochures showing teens and cool people using Leicas. If you had Hilary Duff with a Leica think of all of the tweens who will line up to buy a MP.

[djcastelli]

Last year, I was shooting at the Viet Nam Veterans Memorial on Veteran's Day (11/11). I ran into a US Navy p/journalist. She was young, perhaps 25. She wanted to know what type of camera I was using (M6/35mm Summicron). She had never seen one. I took the time to show her and her comment was that there were 'boxes of them cameras, no one knows how to use 'em' back at her office. So, here's my 2 cents: 1. B&W photography has been a niche market for years, and the onset of digital will have some effect on the area, but not as much as it has on the color market. 2. An entire generation of young people are growing up in a digital age - not just photography, but music, video, etc. Some of them will gravitate toward film, as well as vinal. Most will not. 3. Our communication system is now digital - from instant transmission of images to a newspaper editor to the 'net. We can shoot film, but let's not deceive ourselves into thinking that the world is going to go back. We're going to morph into the 'art photography' muse.
My daughter is attending art school in Boston. Her friends who are photo majors, love shooting film, and must be forced into the digital work areas. They prefer working in film/darkroom, etc. That may be where the future of film photography lies - as a 'art form' (I've always considered it to be a craft, with artistic undetones). These may be the kids keeping film alive. As for shooting; well, the Bessa line of rangefinders are affordable for these kids. If they like shooting w/a rangefinder, then when they get their first grant, they will buy a Leica. My daughter uses a Bessa-R w/a 35mm lens. She loves it. She'll one day get my M2. But not too soon.

[albertwang]

Indeed, it has to be a parental decision to educate their kids about Leicas. I will be doing that someday for my family.

[frc]

Hi Daniel,

Same topic we agreed about on an other thread a whle ago.
Education and giving insight does it all.
Totaly convinced and persistent my offspring is heading for his goal.
Not only is my 15 years old son still taking every job he can get after schooltime to save money for his M6. He even disapproves of my intended purchase of the digital M8.
Leica can advertise whatever they want, it get's them nowhere if we ourselves all swap to Jap-built DSLR's.
Even in these times widespread culture rules over free market economy.
Having done some pro-education myself lately, I was told, do yourself a favour and go get a DSLR. My Leica was, not by all, but by many theachers seen as a snob thing. Expensive and oldfashion. No one seems to realise that the cost of the top notch jap camera's, and many fellowstudents had one is equal to that of a viewfindercamera.
Showing the advantages and disadvantages of both systems is simply not done. Perhaps Leica should bash these people on the head to force a change of climate.


Fr.

[telyt]

Originally Posted by haris

But, secondhand market doesn't do anything to Leica as manufacturer, they don't get money when you buy on secondhand market...

A strong second-hand market narrows the price gap between used and new so some people will buy new instead of a high-priced used camera. Also many people who buy new count on having a strong second-hand market when it's time to trade for newer equipment.

[stunsworth]

Originally Posted by albertwang

Indeed, it has to be a parental decision to educate their kids about Leicas. I will be doing that someday for my family.

In another thread you mentioned that you were 'upgrading' your Leicas for a Fuji roll film camera. You're not setting a very good example for your kids :-)

[albertwang]

Of course, but the Fuji medium format rangefinder is called a Texas Leica so it's still a Leica IMHO.

[fotografr]

When I started shooting professionally nearly 30 years ago, I could barely afford a Nikon, much less a Leica. Still, I knew I had to give myself some kind of edge over people I was competing with and part of that was to get Leica equipment. I started with a couple of M3 double strokes, a 35 with goggles, a 50 cron and a 90. After a few years I was able to get M6 bodies and newer lenses and never looked back from there. I suspect young photographers today can be brought into the Leica market the same way--used equipment initially, then on to the new. The only reason they will have for doing this, however, is quality. They will need to know the investment is worth it and will give their images some noticeable advantage over the Nikon and Canon photos others are producing. I believe the M8 has the potential to become that reason and could well turn out to be so good that even people who don't own Leica glass now will want to start putting a system together. A few years from now, the M8 used market will appear and that will be an entry point for a lot of young photographers.

[albertwang]

Not only that, but we need to get young people interested in image quality. For example, we all know that Canon wide angles suck, but how do we get young people interested in knowing that something like Canon35mm L is not worth it and getting a Summilux 35mm R instead?

[bradreiman]

i bought a IIIb and a scratchy summarit on the internet for a few hundred $. the images sold me. got a digilux2 then an m6 then a dlux2. only really use the m6. 1000$ on ebay. not that expensive. m6 and noctilux, less than my macbook pro. can't wait for m8

[fotografr]

Originally Posted by albertwang

Not only that, but we need to get young people interested in image quality.

That's why I have such high hopes for the M8. I read recently that someone who was looking at sample images taken with the M8 actually "got goosebumps because the quality was so good."

[fotografr]

Originally Posted by bradreiman

m6 and noctilux. can't wait for m8

Brad--with that trio you'll be able to do anything you want to do photographically.