Leica R2.8 16mm Fish-eye Elmarit-R, need your opinion

[LVSBB6]

I'm looking for a wide-angle lens for my R8 and R4.

Take a look at the condition of this lens, what are the white dots on the lens? Would it affect picture quality?
Do you guys think it's worth US$650-? Please advise, thanks!

[andybarton]

The spots could be dust, or cigarette ash or may be physical damage to the glass itself. It almost looks like a 30,000 mile car windscreen...

Judging by the damage to the hood (above the "LEITZ"), I would suspect the latter, but until or unless you can actually see the lens personally, it's very difficult to tell.

If it's physical damage, then it will affect the image, in the same way, for example, that raindrops and dust on the front element do.

I wouldn't buy a lens with front element damage like this, even at what looks like a good price. $650 is around £325, which is very, very cheap for a 16mm. However, you will always be wondering what the photographs would have looked like if the element hadn't been damaged.

ffordes.com (in Scotland), have an E++ one for £599, so "your" one is almost certainly damaged.

[LVSBB6]

I just talked to the shop and they assure those are dust inside the lens, and would not affect image quality. I'll give it a shot and go from there, since its well under the market price.

Thank you for your opinion.

[gvaliquette]

Leo, Andy:

Even if these white spots are damage to the glass itself, the quality should not be impaired, beyond a probable unnoticeable loss of contrast. Given that this is most likely a lens that will be used little, for special effects shots, I would say: Save the $$$ and go for it.

I had the Fisheye-Distagon 16mm f2.8 for the Contarex in a previous life. It was a lens I treasured and always carried on vacations and photo outings, but used only rarely. However, when the occasion presented itself, it was just fabulous. I still treasure a photograph of the Piazza del Pallio in Siena, taken from the top of the campanile with that lens!

Guy

[albertknappmd]

while I am sceptical when it comes to used lenses, ask the seller if you can test the lens yourself... run a few roles and see how it works out... If they say no... forget it.

[k_g_wolf]

This lens looks fine, IMO.

The seller could clean the lens carefully for you and mail you an updated photo. These white spots will disappear most likely, perhaps a few might remain between the lenselements without harming the performance.


Best

[leicanewbie]

I just bought the same type of lens from a german seller on eBay. And I remember seeing
the picture you gave and decided not to bid on it, for the reason that i wasn't sure whether
it would show up in the photos.

At the time, there were a handful of 16mm lenses on eBay. Each seller had a picture of
the lens and the front, and so I went with the clearest one I saw.

I look at it this way, if you're going to spend the money, get the best possible quality you
can for what you're willing to pay. Also realize that if these spots do affect the image
quality, repairing it will cost $$ or you will have to do some photoshop work. Balance that
against the cost.

You can check with the seller, but unless it's a retailer, I don't think they would accept
returns on a used lens. It's always on an "as-is" basis.

That being said, maybe the specks won't add up to anything at all. But perhaps for
certain photos ( closeups, sky shots ) they may appear as small specs, but given the
perspective it may or may not be noticeable.

Either way, if you're not happy with the lens, you can sell it again on eBay.

[stunsworth]

Leo, the lens will probably be ok. If you ever want to frighten yourself shine a torch through a lens, you'll be surprised how much dust there will be.

I don't believe you will ever see these spots on a photograph. If there is an issue it's likely to show itself as a slightly increased chance of flare - and even that's not by any means certain.

[strick]

Originally Posted by stunsworth

I don't believe you will ever see these spots on a photograph.

I'm not that sure. Think of the extreme DOF of the Fisheye, which perhaps shows even tiny objects in the lens itself on a photo?!

I wouldn't buy that lens. It should be easy to get a better one for a good price.

Cheers
Greg

[stunsworth]

Hi Greg, it won't be an issue. I've just checked with a DOF calculator and focussed at 3 feet and f16 the DOF is 1.12 feet to infinity. The dust spots will only be inches from the plane of focus.

[strick]

Thanks, Steve. In Germany we say "Mach aus einer Mücke keinen Elefanten." ("Don't make a mountain out of a molehill.") Would mean here: "Don't make a mountain out of a dust spot." ;-)

Even so, I'd prefer a "clean" lens.

Cheers,
Greg

[SoFi-Chaser]

Originally Posted by stunsworth

Hi Greg, it won't be an issue. I've just checked with a DOF calculator and focussed at 3 feet and f16 the DOF is 1.12 feet to infinity. The dust spots will only be inches from the plane of focus.

Hi Leo,
I use my fisheye-elmarit very often, mostly at f8 to f16. Although the front lens is clear and clean in the morning, more and more dust can be found there, the later it is.
On the slides I only see big spots of water on the front lens. Such small particles can hardly be seen, even on my all-sky-pictures of athmospheric phenomena.

Replacing the front lens will be very, very expensive.
If you only care about the results and if you'll use the lens not very often -- go for it!

Regards

Torsten

[tobey bilek]

This is a fish eye, not a normal rectilinear wide. All lines not going thru the center will be curved

[gvaliquette]

Leo:

Please let us know what you finally decided to do and, if you bought it, how it performs. This could be educational for all of us.

Thanks.

Guy

[LVSBB6]

So I finally bought the lens and it's on its way from Germany, will update this thread once I take some shots with it.

Thanks for all the input guys!

[k_g_wolf]

I wonder if they could remove the specs. Could they ?

If not you will work around them ... A fine MINOLTA-designed piece.

Best

[andybarton]

Originally Posted by k_g_wolf

A fine MINOLTA-designed piece.

Does that make a difference then?

Lots of R lenses are "Minolta" designs. And none the worse for that.